Episode 415 || From The Bookshelf Files, Vol. 2

This week on From the Front Porch, it’s another episode of From The Bookshelf Files! In this new episode series, Annie and The Bookshelf’s Community Manager Felicia Dilbert talk about the ups and downs of owning and running a small business. Today, it’s all about small business woes and wins! If you have a business-related question you’d like Annie and Felicia to explore in a future episode of From The Bookshelf Files, please email Felicia here.

To purchase the books mentioned in this episode, visit our website:

Good to Great by Jim Collins

Beautiful Healing by Felicia Dilbert

Sacred Rest by Dr. Saundra Dalton-Smith

From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in South Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website, www.bookshelfthomasville.com. 

A full transcript of today’s episode can be found below.

Special thanks to Dylan and his team at Studio D Podcast Production for sound and editing and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations. 

Thank you to this week’s sponsor, the 102nd Annual Rose Show and Festival in Thomasville, Georgia. Come visit us for the weekend of April 28th-29th and experience the flowers, fun, food, and shopping in Beautiful Thomasville. Plan your visit at ThomasvilleGa.com.

This week, Annie is reading If We're Being Honest by Cat Shook (releases 4/18/23). Felicia is reading B.F.F. by Christie Tate.

If you liked what you heard in today’s episode, tell us by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts. Or, if you’re so inclined, support us on Patreon, where you can hear our staff’s weekly New Release Tuesday conversations, read full book reviews in our monthly Shelf Life newsletter and follow along as Hunter and I conquer a classic. Just go to patreon.com/fromthefrontporch.

We’re so grateful for you, and we look forward to meeting back here next week.

Our Executive Producers are... Donna Hetchler, Cammy Tidwell, Chantalle C, Kate O’Connell, Nicole Marsee, Wendi Jenkins, and Laurie Johnson.

Transcript:

Annie Jones [00:00:01] Welcome to From the Front Porch, a conversational podcast about books, small business and life in the South. 

[00:00:24] "To love a person is always to love in spite of the fault that intimacy reveals. And so, it is with a place." Margaret Renkl, Graceland at Last.  

[00:00:37] I'm Annie Jones, owner of the Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in beautiful downtown Thomasville, Georgia. And this week, we're back with the second episode in our new series from the Bookshelf Files. I'll be joined in conversation by Bookshelf Community manager and entrepreneur in her own right, Felicia Dilbert. Throughout the series, you'll hear us talk more about the business side of the bookshelf, our stories of growth and the ups and downs of small business ownership. What life looks like at the Bookshelf and how it's changed over the years, and how ideas like Reader Retreats and Shelf Subscriptions come to fruition. Today, we are talking about small business woes. Before we begin, we wanted to let you know we are getting ready to announce our upcoming Reader Retreat dates for 2023. And as we've done in the past, we're letting Patreon supporters know all the details first. You can become a Patreon member at Patreon.com/fromthefrontporch. We'll announce to $50 patrons first, then $20 a month patrons, then $5 a month patrons. So, now is the time to adjust your Patreon support if you want to be the first to know about our reader Retreat dates. Patreon support not in the budget this month? That's okay. We'll announce retreat dates in our free weekly newsletter. Just make sure you're signed up through the link in our show notes. We cannot wait to host more of our From the Front Porch listeners and Bookshelf Friends in 2023. We just finished our February Reader Retreat and it was a smashing success. There are some of our very favorite things to do and we would love to see you there. You can visit Patreon.com/fromthefrontporch for more information, and to make sure you're supporting us on Patreon. Back in January, we launched our From the Bookshelf File series. You can go back and listen to our first episode. That's episode 407. If you want to hear me talk with Felicia about the bookshelf origin story. Now, Felicia and I are back to continue these business minded discussions. Hi, Felicia.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:02:38] Hi, Annie. 

Annie Jones [00:02:40] Welcome back to From the Front Porch.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:02:42] Thank you so, so very much. I'm so glad to be here.  

Annie Jones [00:02:46] Yay! I'm thrilled to get to talk to you. Even though small business woes sound like a negative thing, I don't think it is. It's just part of the ebb and flow of a small business.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:02:56] Absolutely. I think about without wins, we don't have woes.  

Annie Jones [00:03:01] That's right.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:03:01] So, wins are a part of it. And then, of course, there's always that teachable moment. So that's how [crosstalk].  

Annie Jones [00:03:09] That's exactly right. You are a business owner and an author and an entrepreneur in your own right and one of your own woes we hope we conquered at the bookshelf a few weeks ago. Tell us about that.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:03:23] Absolutely. Listen, listen, listen. I had my first book signing in Georgia. Now, I'm a Georgia girl being from Pelham originally born and raised, which is a hop and skip from Thomasville. But this was my first signing in Georgia, and so very much so full circle for me for it to be in Thomasville. I finished high school at Thomasville High School a while back. And I have to tell you, it was a true joy to have a book signing here at the Bookshelf, having had a chance to fall in love even more with the culture and the energy that you've created here at this beautiful store. And the weather couldn't have been better, and it was a sold out event. And I felt like literally folks were buying a piece of my heart when they bought my book. And it was so well-attended and just really speaks to all the different ripples that I can see this beautiful legacy of this store contributed to. It's extremely special. So, yes.  

Annie Jones [00:04:28] I'm so glad you got to do that. So, Felicia is an author. She has a book called Beautiful Healing, which you can find through the link in our show notes. It's available on the Bookshelf website. And because of Felicia's past work and current work as a writer and an author, she also functions as the Bookshelves community manager, particularly dealing with our local author community. So, if you're listening to this and you have written a book too and you, like Felicia, maybe are struggling with sales of that book or figuring out how to promote that book, if you're a regional author particularly from North Florida or South Georgia, we would love to help you. And so, you can go to our show notes and email Felicia at Community@Bookshelfthomasville.com. You can also go to Bookshelfthomasville.com, where you will see links to pages for local authors. You can find out more about our author process. And Felicia can help walk you through that and turn your woe into a win, we hope.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:05:26] Yes. Yes, most definitely. And just a quick plug for the Bookshelf's Local Authors collective, which will be rolling out in May. And this is a neat opportunity for folks that maybe you haven't written your book yet, but you really want to write a book. You have a story to tell. You have ideas that just keep coming back up and you're not sure what to do with them. Well, the Bookshelf here in Thomasville has a solution for that. So, if you're interested in more information about that as well, please send me an email Community@Bookshelfthomasville.com  

Annie Jones [00:05:56] Perfect.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:05:57] All right. Yes, Annie. So, let's pivot Bookshelf woes. Your baby the Bookshelf turns 10 this year this May! Is that accurate?  

Annie Jones [00:06:10] That is right. She's technically 30 something, maybe even approaching 40. But for me and my tenure with her, we are approaching our 10 year birthday/anniversary.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:06:25] Got it. Which is so true speaking to the passion and the heart of your business, it's been with you from the very beginning it sounds like. Yes.  

Annie Jones [00:06:36] That's right.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:06:38] In terms of the, let's say, for example, pandemic-- I think we maybe touched on this a little bit in the last episode, but obviously that was a major woe. And from what I've learned from you, I've seen how you have illustrated that same type of grit and focus, dealing with different things this year. And I started in August of last year, but I've seen you really have that same sense of alignment with your values personally, as well as how that translates over into business in the way that you take care of things and stay in the moment. I love that you recently said that you're not so much in the place anymore of throwing spaghetti on the wall, but more so sustainability of what you've built. So, with that being said, what are some of those things that if you could teach somebody something about, okay, here's a woe number one. Starting a business, starting a bookstore, what would a woe look like to you? What comes to mind?  

Annie Jones [00:07:38] Yeah. Certainly, the pandemic was a turning point for the Bookshelf. I think the pandemic was a turning point for a lot of people and a lot of businesses, too. But even before the pandemic, when Jordan and I took over fully, we took the bookshelf over fully in 2018, kind of took the finances into our own name, took out a small business loan. I think immediately one of the woes for me that I just was not prepared for was taxes. It sounds like, of course, Annie, small business owners pay taxes. But I knew that. I knew I was paying sales tax. I knew I was paying city taxes and county taxes and occupation tax and all kinds of things like that. But I just did not realize the toll that owning a small business would take on my personal finances. And I guess the shock that is to go from being like a young married couple who gets tax refunds to owing the government money, this was really shocking to me. And I don't like talking about taxes or accounting, but I also want future small business owners or people who are entrepreneurial and are considering owning their own business or starting their own business, I do want them to be maybe a little bit more prepared than I was for that financial burden and that financial risk. And I think the first year we fully owned the bookshelf, we just owed a lot of money and it was just not a sum I was at all anticipating. And now we don't do our taxes ourselves. We work with an accountant. We plan in advance. We plan throughout the year. We save money throughout the year to be able to pay those taxes. So, I really just wanted to mention that. It's not something I want to dwell a ton on because everybody's business is so different and what they owe and how they owe it and how they pay it will all be different depending on your small business. But one of the best things I did for my own sanity and for the Bookshelf's growth and stability, was hire a bookkeeper and hire an accountant. For so long I was functioning as the bookkeeper. And while I'm grateful that I have those basic skills and that I know and have a basic understanding, I am so glad that ball is now in a professional court. And so, when I talk to small business owners or prospective bookstore owners, that's one of the first things I say, is that other things you can kind of put off, but to me, hiring a trustworthy accountant and bookkeeper should be at the top of your list for your own sanity, and for your own peace of mind. I think finances are something that will always plague me a little bit. Bookstores are not particularly high profit, and so I know that I'm always going to have money woes. That is something that I think is just part of owning a bookstore. But there are ways to be proactive, to have a little bit of security, to have a little bit of stability. And I think part of that is finding an accountant, finding a bookkeeper, and knowing, okay, I'm probably going to owe taxes at the end of this year, so how can I save money throughout the year to make it hurt a little bit less?  

Felicia Dilbert [00:11:10] Absolutely. That's a great point. And it really speaks to that nuance of the person that is just getting started and wondering, where do I put my money? If there's a profit, where does it go? So, it sounds like bookkeeper, accountant would be a great place for that to go.  

Annie Jones [00:11:30] Yes. Unless you are fortunate enough to have a business degree or an MBA and that stuff comes naturally to you. I think other parts of small business ownership come naturally to me and bookkeeping and accounting aren't one of them. And to finally be able to look at our finances and to realize, like you said, "I have some money, where can I put it?" And to also know and acknowledge I don't have to be the expert here. I can be an expert in other things. I do not have to be the expert in this. For my own peace of mind, I can hire an expert to do this part.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:12:04] Absolutely. I remember crossing that bridge and I was so stressed out. And when I found a solution for that, I'm like, oh, I felt inspired again. The creative ideas were coming because all of that wasn't in my wheelhouse and I was able to get back to the fun stuff. So, that's a good point. Awesome. So then one follow-up question to that. I notice on days when it's time to pay bills and you'll say, "I'll take care of the bills today," how do you deal with nuance kind of feelings that may come up on those days? I guess what I'm trying to say is it may not be a woe anymore, you've hired an accountant, but just those woe moments that can come up. How do you manage so that that doesn't derail your day?  

Annie Jones [00:12:51] Yeah. That's such a good question because I think money is the thing that most often makes me vomity about owning my own business. Look, we have a bookkeeper, we have an accountant, but I still pay the bills. And I thought long and hard about who could I delegate that to? What would that look like? But the reality is, by paying the bills, I can better manage and understand the cash flow of the Bookshelf. And so, I still pay the bills. It helps me know how much we're spending. It helps me know where that money is going. Again, I do not claim to be an expert at those things. If somebody came to me, and was like, "Annie, teach me your ways about cash flow." I would say, "No, I can't. You should go find somebody else." I can help teach you other things, maybe marketing or book buying or something like that. I would not feel comfortable teaching somebody cash flow and bill pay, but I have worked out a system that works for me. I think there's almost an unspoken thing at the Bookshelf now that I have my own office-- which it took years to get to this point. But now that I have my own office, if the door is closed, that means I'm doing some kind of work that I'm trying to do uninterrupted. And that often is bill pay. And it's because I've got to turn on either some music or a podcast, sit down, open all my mail, organize all the bills, structure it out, plan it out. I'm a big planner. What am I paying this week? What am I paying next week, etc.? And so, for me, bill pay is my way to still keep a finger on the pulse of the business and the cash flow side of things. But then any time I hit-- let's say I get something in the mail from the Department of Revenue, I would be sweaty over that. I would start to think, "Oh, no, what have I done?" Just immediately worst case scenario. And now I feel like I open that mail, I read it. I try to understand it. If it's something I can understand, maybe I solve it. But if not, I now have somebody on my team, my bookkeeper, my accountant, who I know I'm going to trust them with this because I don't trust myself always with this. And so, to me, that's the difference, is realizing I'm not the only person doing this anymore. There is somebody behind me. And that is something so comforting because so much of small business ownership-- even though it is a team, the Bookshelf is a team and a big team because we've gotten to be a big team. But there is still some stuff that really only falls on the owner's shoulders and that's how it's supposed to be. The big financial stresses should not fall on Olivia's shoulders. They're supposed to fall on mine. I'm who took the risk. I'm who signed the papers. It should fall on me. And so, so much of small business ownership, some of those big stressors do fall on me or on Jordan. It's nice to know that behind me and Jordan, there is an accountant helping us make plans, helping us read documents. And Jordan is a big part of that too. I say account, I say bookkeeper, it's also helpful to have married an attorney. I didn't know that would be appropriate, but it is. It's something that I find helpful. If there's something I get in the mail or if there's something I see that I don't fully understand, I have somebody who's got my back who's helping me interpret that and helping me follow that.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:16:10] Absolutely.  

Annie Jones [00:16:11] Yeah. Bill paydays are big days. They're days when the door of the office is closed. They're days when I sit and I try to keep things organized. That's my number one tip, I guess, to keep things organized. And I get those skills from my mom. But I think it's also just having somebody on your team who can also help you interpret those things and help have your back so that you don't feel like it is all falling on you.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:16:34] Absolutely. There's that saying there's a cost to be the boss, you know? That makes me think about what you're speaking of.  

Annie Jones [00:16:43] Yeah. There should be a cost. That's part of it. Jordan and I talk all the time. Good bosses bear those heavy burdens because they're supposed to.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:16:54] Absolutely. And I believe that the way that they do that, the way it looks, the way it feels to the employee, the way it translates to the world is what makes the difference between the good ones and the great ones.  

Annie Jones [00:17:11] Yeah.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:17:11] So speaking of which, another woe that I was just thinking about and I'm curious how this has impacted you, have you ever dealt with comparing your business to other businesses?  

Annie Jones [00:17:27] Yeah, I think for so long I didn't know what I was doing. And because I didn't know what I was doing, there wasn't time for comparison. There was just, like, put your blinders on and do the work because I didn't really know what else to do. As the Bookshelf grew a little bit and as I became more comfortable in my role, I do think there could be a tendency to look around and see, oh, how come that bookstore got that author? Or how come that bookstore got that feature in that publication? But I will say this about bookstores-- I cannot speak to other businesses because I don't know about other businesses-- but in the bookstore world because indie bookstores are so very indie and are so very independent, comparison does not come naturally because every independent bookstore is so different. And so, what works even in nearby Tallahassee, might not work in Thomasville or probably won't work in Thomasville. What works at a bookstore in New York probably won't work here or may or may not work here. And so, once I really realized, oh, the Bookshelf's bread and butter cannot be author events, right? No major author is coming through Thomasville. You and I both know Thomasville has no interstate, no major airport. We're just not going to be like a hub for big name authors and big name publishers-- unless you're Delia Owens and you're from Thomasville. And that's a very bizarre exception.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:19:02] Right. This is true.  

Annie Jones [00:19:02] So, I think once I understood-- and I think this was a game changer. I don't think comparison was hard for me at first because I was just in the trenches. You can't really compare when you're in the trenches. But then when I did start to compare-- I think when I flipped the switch from the attitude of, oh, well, good for them. That works for them, it probably doesn't work here. And once I started focusing instead on what might work at the Bookshelf or what could work at the Bookshelf or in Thomasville, I think that just became a much healthier position from which to own a business. And looking at bookstores for occasional inspiration, but also not getting too bogged down into what other bookstores do, because other bookstores are located in university town or in urban town centers or strip malls. All of which look so different from what's happening in Thomasville, in rural South Georgia, in this quaint downtown. And so, once I instead could just think, oh, that's fun, or that's inspiring, but really instead focus on my own work and my own store. I think just moving that focus and, yes, occasionally drawing inspiration from other stores, but really having the realization that what works for another store might not work and instead of that being a bad thing for the Bookshelf, spending my time and energy on implementing things that do work at the Bookshelf. A few years ago, we stopped pursuing big name authors because we realized even if we got a big name author, we might not be able to show them a good audience. We might not even be able to show them a large crowd because that's just not who we are. So, instead, let's host a pen to plate dinner where we can partner with a local chef and clear out the middle of the store and that we sell out no problem. So, I think it was just realizing what works for the Bookshelf may or may not work for other stores. So, the comparison thing, that's how I approach it and that's how I've approached it for the last several years. And it's a lot better for my mental health and a lot better for the health of the store.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:21:11] Absolutely. It sounds like your passion for what you do and the love for what you've built really has a power of helping you stay in alignment to what you've been called to do. Because it's almost like a kite. If you're steering it, then it'll go in the direction you want. But all this other stuff could just be a lot of noise.  

Annie Jones [00:21:36] I think partly that is my personality. So, my personality really likes to turn the volume down. My personality really likes quiet, not a lot of noise. And I think there are so many parts of my personality that I do not think are necessarily well-suited to entrepreneurship. But I think one thing that I'm really grateful to be an INTJ Enneagram five, is I think it comes more naturally to me to ignore. And I don't know any other word, another phrase, except to turn the blinders on. I also will say here that several years ago, some friends of mine who also run their own podcast, they gave me the suggestion-- and maybe they even talked about it on their show, but they were like, "Oh, we don't listen to Pop Culture Podcast." I think it was Jamie from the Popcast. She was like, " Oh, I don't listen to pop culture podcasts because I want to make sure our content is always fresh." And so, I think one thing that's sometimes surprising to folks, is I don't listen to a lot of book podcasts. I'm not subscribed to any book podcasts. Occasionally, I'll listen to an episode. I want to support other book podcasts, but it helps me to not listen to other book podcasts so I don't accidentally take content that's not mine or take ideas that's not mine. My journalism brain is always thinking of what happens when inspiration becomes plagiarism or something like that?  

Felicia Dilbert [00:23:02] Seriously.  

Annie Jones [00:23:04] It just helps me. I can support and shout out and cheer on other book podcasts, but I don't listen to those. And that's at the advice of these other wiser business owners who kind of set that precedent. And that was a bit of advice that I'm glad I received early on, because it's not just the Bookshelf, the store, right? There's also From the Front Porch. So, there are lots of aspects to this business and lots of ways where comparison and the green eyed monster could come out to play. And we don't play that game.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:23:38] Yeah, I'm so glad to hear that. It makes me think about honoring your voice and the gift that you've been given with the Bookshelf, From the Front Porch, which Patreon supporters do an awesome job of helping to keep that going. And it just speaks to stewarding that gift well by quieting all of that. So, I think that's actually more of a superpower than a personality quirk because, I mean, it works. When I listen to you, I don't hear, oh, this is residual thoughts of somebody else's. It doesn't sound like anyone else's. It sounds like you and Hunter or Erin or whoever.  

Annie Jones [00:24:24] Yeah. That's the goal.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:24:25] Absolutely. Awesome. Okay, so then another business woe in terms of growing a team, what's that been like?  

Annie Jones [00:24:37] I know that I have said this anecdote before. I say it all the time because it is true. But when I took over the Bookshelf and my mom would come up from Tallahassee so that I could take a bathroom break because I was too scared to leave the floor of the Bookshelf. Of course, now I would leave the floor of the Bookshelf. I trust Thomasville. But at that time, I was so terrified of doing the wrong thing. I was so scared of somebody thinking that I was irresponsible, that this young whippersnapper from Tallahassee had come up and was going to ruin Thomasville's bookstore. I was so scared that I didn't even like to use the bathroom unless somebody else was in the store. I say that to say the team was small. So, initially the team was the former Bookshelf owner, myself, a manager, maybe a part time bookseller. And then it shrunk because when you inherit a team, that team might not want the kind of business, the kind of mission, the kind of goals that you want. And so, that was a growing pain, right? Was coming on board and becoming the new boss and the new owner of the Bookshelf and inheriting a team and realizing, oh, we might have different visions and this is the vision going forward. And so, do you like this vision? Is this something that appeals to you? And if not, we might have to part ways. And so, that was painful. That was painful as a 27-year-old business owner.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:26:05] I can imagine.  

Annie Jones [00:26:07] And so, growing a team is its own thing, right? Now the Bookshelf has 9 to 10 employees. Michelle is our long distance employee, so really we're at about 10. And that is so vastly different from three. That is so different. Olivia and Nancy, both this year are celebrating their five year anniversary with the Bookshelf.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:26:32] Awesome.  

Annie Jones [00:26:32] And so, they know what the team used to look like. The team just used to be much smaller. And at the time that was fine. That is what the Bookshelf required. But once the pandemic hit, once the podcast grew, once online orders grew, that's when our business needed to grow. And so, pre-pandemic, really in 2019, is when I took a trip with some other entrepreneurs. It was another one of those kind of life changing moments. And I'm so glad I went pre-pandemic because it set me on the right course, that when March of 2020 hit, I had already started to make proactive changes to the Bookshelf. Meaning when I took this literary London trip in the summer of 2019, these women kept talking about business coaches. And I remember sitting at a restaurant thinking to myself, "Excuse me, what?" Excuse me, business coaches are a thing you can have? And from that point, finding a business coach, acquiring a business coach, that business coach got me through the pandemic. Then finding a new business coach. Anyway, business coaching has been something that helped me hire and grow a team because I do think I love hiring. I love growing a team. It is really hard. And my business coach was so good and she would use the phrase that I had not heard before, but it's the phrase put the right person in the right seat on the bus. So, a lot of times I was hiring a good person and perhaps even the right person, but I had them in the wrong seat. And so, over the past couple of years, it's really been about, okay, wait a minute, what are the seats? And then once I've established the seats, then hiring for the seat. Instead, I was really doing the reverse of that for a long time. I was hiring the right person or a person I thought would be a good fit, but I was then crafting a role around them. And that was great until retail there's high turnover and that person leaves and now you've crafted a role around them and the next person is never going to fit that role because you've created that role for that person. And so, switching that and setting the roles first and then hiring for the roles has been so much better for the bookshelf, for me, and I think for the team. I think for the people, it's better for them too to know the expectations, to know the role that has been established, the role that they're getting in. And I think it will help in the future when we do have turnover now it won't be as traumatic. Before, if somebody left their role, it was awful because it was like, oh, no.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:29:27] Yeah. I imagine. And even maybe down to-- I don't know if you've always used Google for emails, but even down to we don't even have the email information from that person's positions because of the Google space, which is awesome. But I think that is really powerful and there's so much inclusivity and what you just said in terms of when you're interviewing that person and you're thinking about what skills they have and then being able to see does that even fit here? Is there a seat for that? Because it might be that it's not, but it doesn't mean that they're not a great person, that you won't get their information on file.  

Annie Jones [00:30:10] That's right. It's just a healthier way to interview for the person as well. It helps them know, oh, this is actually about the role. It's not about you as a person, it's about the role. And so, I hope that even hiring has become a gentler process for the candidates as well. And that's the goal because it hasn't always been that way. I've made a lot of mistakes and, look, sometimes I am hard on myself about that. And then I have to remember, while I was 27 when I took this over, the only leadership experience I had was being the editor of the school paper. And that's just a very different responsibility than the current one. And so, no, I have not always done it perfectly. But I do think having a business coach helped and gave me wisdom. That seat on the bus thing, I don't think that's new information. Probably another business owner out there is like, "Yeah, Annie, I've heard that before," but I had not. And so, to have somebody else say it to me was groundbreaking. It was like, oh, you mean I can do that? Because hiring is hard and interviewing is hard, and to go in with this new mindset is so much better.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:31:22] Yeah, I love that. Would you like to share who your business coach is?  

Annie Jones [00:31:28] Yeah, I'll share it. Emily Freeman. Emily Freeman is my business coach. Most people will know her from the podcast The Next Right Thing. But she and I met on the literary London trip and I had a different business coach who I loved, Beth Silvers, who's the co-host of the Pantsuit Politics podcast. But she stopped coaching and focused on that podcast full time. And so, I had to find a new coach. Emily does creative coaching. And, for me, that creative coaching is business coaching and it falls under the Bookshelf and I've been so grateful. She's especially helpful with growing and forming and sustaining a team and creating a sustainable system. Sustainability, I think, is a big goal for me right now, and so she's been really helpful with that.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:32:13] That's incredible. I think it's so powerful when you find that alignment with that coach. I also want to reference that it looks like the author of the book that you referenced, his name is Jim Collins and the book is called Good to Great: Why Some Companies Make the Leap and Others Don't. So, you can add that to the show notes. 

Annie Jones [00:32:35] Yeah. We'll put that in the show notes. That's where that phrase right sit on the bus comes from. I have not read the book. Thank you Emily for making me not have to read that book.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:32:46] It is powerful. It's a powerful analogy, though. And I will share too. I have a delightful business coach who I met through Instagram. Her name is Dr. Sandra Dodson Smith, and she wrote a book called Sacred Rest. But, again, that alignment is really powerful. And she just helps me to understand that you don't have to do everything right away and you don't have to be on all the platforms, Tik Tok and all of that stuff. 

Annie Jones [00:33:23] Find what works for you.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:33:24] Exactly. Her words exactly. So, I love it. Awesome. Well, the other thing that I wanted to talk to you about in terms of-- and you just touched on Annie. But how do you rest? How do you break away? I know on Instagram I see you travel. I know you just recently got back from Cheer Her On Weekend. And I know other people do too. Thousands of people listening see you on there doing fun things. What helps you to breathe when you're off?  

Annie Jones [00:33:54] Yeah. I think that's such a key part to being able to handle the woes of small business ownership. And I haven't always done it very well, but for me, travel is great for both literal rest and then just creative rest. Travel is how I kind of -- you know that saying, like, that's how I fill my cup. That's how I finally allow myself maybe to think creatively instead of in problem solving mode or something like that. And so, that is part of the reason I love to travel so much when I can, is because we talk about the comparison game and comparison is not something I'm interested in, but inspiration is something I am interested in. And so, traveling and going not just to different bookstores but just to different places in general is a great way of gathering ideas and thinking creatively. Several years ago now, I visited a dear friend of mine in Kansas City and she worked for a nonprofit. And they did these things they called-- I don't even know what they called them anymore, but they essentially were literary lunches and she just kind of mentioned them offhand and how they would bring in an author who would talk about books. And I looked at my friend and I said, "Wait, I think I could do that." And so, that wasn't an idea from a bookstore. That was inspiration from a nonprofit in the Midwest that then I could tweak and work into the Bookshelf's platform. And so, that's part of the reason I travel. It's part of the reason I love visiting my friends. None of my dearest friends owns a bookstore like I like. And most of my friends aren't necessarily entrepreneurs. I have some friends who are entrepreneurs, but many of my friends are just incredibly smart, well-rounded, thoughtful women. And when I get to visit them and talk with them, that is so inspiring. And that fills me up and gives me energy. And so, weekends like Cheer Her On or less scheduled weekends just with dear friends, all of that is very helpful. I also love my home. I find a lot of rest in my home and I love coming home at the end of the day. I love shutting down at the end of the day. I very much treasure my time at home and that is where I find rest is. Because in my house I'm not bookstore Annie. Jordan doesn't love me because of the bookshelf. And so, I am so glad that I have relationships and places where I am not an Annie B. Jones, I'm Annie Sue Butterworth or I'm Annie or I'm Annie Sue. That's how I find rest-- is I love what I do. I love it very much. The only way that I can do it and continue to be authentically me is by not owning a business 24/7. Like, by turning that part of my brain off a little bit at the end of the day, by knowing that I am loved and cared for by people who are not related to the Bookshelf. 

Felicia Dilbert [00:37:09] Absolutely. And as you should. And by the way, Annie, your house is beautiful. You decorate so beautifully.  

Annie Jones [00:37:21] Thank you. That's my mom. My mom always was so good at decorating and loving our home. Well, and I think she loves to say my tastes are different from hers. And that's probably true, although certainly inspired by hers. But my house definitely looks like me and it looks like Jordan. But I'm so glad I had my mom to kind of show me because I just love having a cozy, comfy home at the end of the day.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:37:48] Absolutely. Good stuff. This could be speaking of, again, your personality type. I'm thinking about the person right now that may say, "Annie, how do you have the confidence to try different things?" Like, you talk with your friend at the nonprofit and she's doing something similar to literary lunch. Was there anything in you that was, like, "I don't know if I could do that in Thomasville?" It sounds like there wasn't. It sounds like it was, like, "Yeah, I think I could do that in Thomasville." But I'm thinking about people that second guess themselves a little bit and just have a thing about making the decision to try something new.  

Annie Jones [00:38:26] I think if you know your audience and you know your business well, then it is easier to be confident in the decisions you are making. So, it really was pretty easy for me to listen to my friend talk and for me to then turn around and be like, okay, I think I can implement that here. It also became a lot easier to implement things like that when I had a team. Now then the burden became greater, right? I don't want to implement something with a large team that then doesn't work; whereas, before it was just my own time I was risking. So, there are pros and cons to growing a team and having a team that can help you try some of these things. I think I began throwing spaghetti on the wall-- that's my favorite phrase because it's just the best way I know how to do it. Like, you throw a lot of things on the wall, you see what sticks. And I think that's one of the perks of small business ownership, is if something doesn't work, unless it was just this huge financial risk, it's not a big deal. Like, it's not a big deal to fail because there's always going to be another idea or another thing to try. And so, something like a literary lunch, that felt like there's not a lot of financial risk there. It's literally planning it, putting tickets out there. If people buy them, great. If people don't, we'll know. And there are other examples at the Bookshelf of something that did not work, where we tried something and it didn't work and that didn't diminish my confidence. It just made me know, okay, Thomasville doesn't want that. Or our virtual friends, our long distance friends, they don't want that. And so, as long as it's a low financial risk, I think it can for me pretty easy. What I would say to somebody else is, just know your audience and your business really well. And then I think those risks are easier to take. I think it's easier to have confidence in something when you know your team, when you know your audience. When you know those things really well, I think the confidence comes more naturally.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:40:32] Absolutely. That's an awesome answer to that. You are so well versed in what you do and what you like and what has worked from your experience of being in business. You mentioned in the beginning, it was not always that way and you don't know what you don't know. And then every day we learn something new. But I would just encourage people that are listening not to compare their right now to where you are too years in.  

Annie Jones [00:41:00] Yes, that's so true. Because now I'm 37 talking to you on a podcast. So, yeah, I'm way more confident than I was 10 years ago. Ten years ago, I just hoped I knew what I was doing. But now I still don't always know what I'm doing, but I definitely know better than I did. And I think that I know better. And I certainly hope I know better now than I knew then what might work, what might not work. And I'm grateful. That's what experience brings. And there are blessings to being young and inexperienced because then trying maybe is easier because you don't have as much to fear. The older you get, perhaps you have a little bit more to fear. I don't know. So, there are pluses and minuses to both. But I do think one of the pluses of having 10 years of experience is the ability to kind of know right off that'll work or probably not, and if not, it's not the end of the world.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:42:02] Exactly. I love it. I was speaking with the niece who travels for the Reader Retreat, and we had a wonderful dialog, which is-- shameless plug for Read Retreat, they're awesome. Definitely want to be on the lookout for the next one. But she called it like a life chat or whatnot. But really it was just about the power of the weekend and how inspiring it was for her and to be able to go back to her life having had a chance to just breathe with all these other people that love to read and that love Thomasville and love the Bookshelf. And it was just a real full circle moment for me. And because I don't remember when the Bookshelf was started, it's been around for a long time. But I do remember when I was in high school and it was owned by someone else and a wonderful person, but I now know what it is like to work here and experience it in 2023 and it's all good. And so, it was just super special to be there with her and see this whole moment for her unfold and likely for so many other women that visit-- and men. And shout out to independent [Inaudible] coming up. It's going to be fun.  

Annie Jones [00:43:15] Yes, I definitely hope that reader retreat for the people who get to attend, who choose to attend, I hope that it is for them what traveling and going places is like for me. I mean, that's what I want. When I went to Cheer Her On or when I went to literary in London, I came back rejuvenated, refreshed and also ready to go with new ideas. And so, I hope that the folks who get to come to reader retreat leave feeling the same way, whether or not they work-- in fact, most of them don't work in the book industry or in bookstore world. But maybe it just gives them the inspiration they need for their own work in nonprofits, in mothering, in the business world, or whatever it is they're doing. That's what traveling does for me. And so, that's what definitely what I want reader retreats to be for other people, too.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:44:10] Absolutely. I had a chance to connect with Mattie from Iowa and Mary from Atlanta recently, and truly, I just have to say, because I'm not used to all of this like you are. What I mean is just the lovely, lovely smiles and warm hugs and just excitement from women all over the world that are either emailing or are corresponding on Patreon, or are on Instagram leaving a note, or are liking different posts, or are showing so much love to our recent visitors from Iowa and Atlanta. And they're just such a diverse group of ladies all over the world moms, daughters, sisters, friends, teachers, you name it, and all for the love of books and for this beautiful store you built which a couple of ladies referred to as the Mecca of bookstores. They are serious, serious about the Bookshelf. But it's just thrilling. And so, I wanted to take time to add voice to what I say often here in person to you. I think there's just something special about saying what you feel one-on-one to a person, but also in the company of others and before others so that folks know. Because some of these people would never know about, we would just know here in the store, oh, everybody loves the Bookshelf. But I want people to know because it's so incredible.  

Annie Jones [00:45:51] That's what we were talking about at the top. There are woes and I never want to shy away. I want to be transparent in as much as is possible about those woes. I want to be transparent about the growing pains. I want to be transparent about taxes. I want to be transparent about hiring. And I want to be transparent about the hard stuff of small business, because I just want people to be prepared if they-- and look, anybody in their job, whether they own a small business or not, there are hard parts. I have friends who are teachers, who are educators, there are hard parts to that job. And so, there's hard stuff with every vocation and I don't want to shy away from that. But like we were talking about at the top of the episode, without the woes there wouldn't be wins and vice versa. And so, it is really exciting and comforting, especially, I think, after the stress of the last couple of years as far as the pandemic goes and the pandemic's impact on the Bookshelf's business and things like that. It is really exciting and rewarding to see people come to the Bookshelf from Iowa or from-- this weekend somebody came from South Dakota. To get to see them and to get to look them in the face and thank them for their long distance support and to realize, oh, the Bookshelf has an impact far beyond the brick streets of Thomasville, which is something I wanted but I didn't know was possible. And so, that is a huge win. And to get to celebrate something we talk about at the Bookshelf often because as a team we're really good at problem solving and we're really good at identifying ways to make things better. And I'm so glad to be surrounded by people for whom that comes naturally. Like, all of us can look at, for example, reader retreat, and we can look at things that we want to tweak and make better. But I also want to have a team that is really good at celebrating the wins because so often we can skip right over those. And so, I'm glad you said that today because I do think it is worthwhile to celebrate the happy thing. So, to honor the woes and what they teach us, and then also to celebrate the wins too.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:48:00] Absolutely. I love it. One last thing. Something that comes to mind is when I had a chance to see the different faces of the folks that came to the book signing. And I've seen this happen with other local authors as well. When you see people walk in and they're drawn to your work and they pick it up and they flip through it, for me, is such a powerful feeling because I remember toiling over what that cover looks like and saying that the color of the envelope isn't quite right yet. I've got to find another gradient. And so, when I saw the ladies at both of the read retreats, but especially the one in February, I just remember thinking, these are faces. These women are real, you know? Folks that you dreamed up one day. I hope I can do this. I just hope that this resonates with folks that have dreams and things that they'd love to do and just haven't seen it come to fruition yet. But it is so worth it because when it does come to fruition, it's beautiful.  

Annie Jones [00:49:05] It is. You're absolutely right. I hope that talking a little bit about some business woes and business wins has been helpful to listeners today. If you have a question that you'd like us to address in an upcoming episode of Files from the Bookshelf, we would love for you to email Felicia, though. So, you can email Felicia at Community@bookshelfthomasville.com Let her know what aspects of entrepreneurship, of small business ownership that you would like to learn more about. We have a couple of these episodes planned for throughout the rest of the year, and we would love your input as we build content for those episodes. So, you can email Felicia at Community@bookshelfthomasville.com. And, of course, if you are a local or regional author trying to spread the word about your work, Felicia would love to hear from you as well and help you potentially schedule your own book signing at the Bookshelf.  

Felicia Dilbert [00:49:55] Yay! Sounds great.  

Annie Jones: [00:50:00] This week, What I'm Reading is brought to you by the 102nd Annual Rose Show and Festival here in Thomasville, Georgia. Come visit Thomasville for the weekend of April 28th and 29th and experience the flowers, fun food and shopping in beautiful Thomasville, Georgia. Plan your visit at ThomasvilleGa.com. If you follow me on Instagram, you might know that last year I was able to be a judge for the Rose Show Parade, during the Rose Show parade and festival in downtown Thomasville. It was one of the highlights of my Thomasville life. Rose Show is such a beautiful weekend filled with loads of fun festivities. It is the quintessential small town experience. The weather is beautiful. I mean, fingers crossed, right? But even the year that it rained, Thomasville did such a good job of pivoting and making wonderful plans and just making everything feel so special. It's just a special weekend, and it's one of the weekends that I'm really grateful to live in this small town. And being able to judge the Rose Show parade was genuinely a highlight of my life here. So I hope you can come and join us for the 102nd Annual Rose Show and Festival here in Thomasville, April 28th and 29th. Go ahead and make your plans now. Secure your hotel reservations, get your Airbnbs, because it's just a really lovely way to back in spring and to enjoy all our small town has to offer.  

Annie Jones [00:51:30] This week. I'm reading If We're Being Honest by Cat Shook. Felicia, what are you reading this week?  

Felicia Dilbert [00:51:37] I am reading BFF by Christie Tate.  

Annie Jones: [00:51:42] Thank you again to our sponsor, the 102nd Annual Rose Show and Festival here in Thomasville, Georgia. 

From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in Thomasville, Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website: bookshelfthomasville.com A full transcript of today’s episode can be found at:  fromthefrontporchpodcast.com  Special thanks to Studio D Podcast Production for production of From the Front Porch and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations. Our Executive Producers are… 

Donna Hetchler Cammy Tidwell Chantalle C Kate O'Connell 

Executive Producers (Read Their Own Names): Nicole Marsee Wendi Jenkins Laurie Johnson 

Annie Jones: If you’d like to support From the Front Porch, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts. Your input helps us make the show even better and reach new listeners. All you have to do is open up the Podcast App on your phone, look for From the Front Porch, scroll down until you see ‘Write a Review’ and tell us what you think. Or, if you’re so inclined, support us over on Patreon, where we have 3 levels of support - Front Porch Friends, Book Club Companions, and Bookshelf Benefactors. Each level has an amazing number of benefits like bonus content, access to live events, discounts, and giveaways. Just go to:  patreon.com/fromthefrontporch We’re so grateful for you, and we look forward to meeting back here next week.