Episode 490 || Literary Therapy Vol. 22
This week on From the Front Porch, it’s time for another Literary Therapy session! Our literary Frasier Crane, Annie, is back to answer more of your reading questions and dilemmas. If you have a question you would like Annie to answer in a future episode, you can leave us a voicemail here.
To purchase the books mentioned in this episode, visit our website (type “Episode 490” into the search bar and tap enter to find the books mentioned in this episode) or download and shop on The Bookshelf’s official app:
Summer Stage by Meg Mitchell Moore
Tom Lake by Ann Patchett
Our Town by Thornton Wilder
City of Girls by Elizabeth Gilbert
When You Get the Chance by Emma Lord
Limelight by Amy Poeppel
The Chelsea Girls by Fiona Davis
Someday, Someday, Maybe by Lauren Graham (unavailable to order)
The Matzah Ball by Jean Meltzer
Magical Meet Cute by Jean Meltzer (out 8/27)
Tomorrow, and Tomorrow, and Tomorrow by Gabrielle Zevin
Everything, Everything by Nicola Yoon
Hello Stranger by Katherine Center
All's Well by Mona Awad
Lycanthropy and Other Chronic Illnesses by Kristen O'Neal (unavailable to order)
Get a Life, Chloe Brown by Talia Hibbert
Black Girls Must Die Exhausted by Jayne Allen
Blue Sisters by Coco Mellors (out 9/3)
The Crane Wife by C.J. Hauser (unavailable to order)
Family of Origin by C.J. Hauser (unavailable to order)
Priestdaddy by Patricia Lockwood
No One Is Talking About This by Patricia Lockwood
Not That Kind of Girl by Carlene Bauer
Girls They Write Songs About by Carlene Bauer
Frances and Bernard by Carlene Bauer
Fly Girl by Ann Hood
The Stolen Child by Ann Hood
Lots of Candles, Plenty of Cake by Anna Quindlen (unavailable to order)
After Annie by Anna Quindlen
Early Morning Riser by Katherine Heiny (unavailable to order)
Margo's Got Money Troubles by Rufi Thorpe
Goodbye, Vitamin by Rachel Khong
The Misfortune of Marion Palm by Emily Culliton (unavailable to order)
Rabbit Cake by Annie Hartnett
From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in South Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website, www.bookshelfthomasville.com.
A full transcript of today’s episode can be found below.
Special thanks to Dylan and his team at Studio D Podcast Production for sound and editing and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations.
This week, Annie is reading Intermezzo by Sally Rooney.
If you liked what you heard in today’s episode, tell us by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts. You can also support us on Patreon, where you can access bonus content, monthly live Porch Visits with Annie, our monthly live Patreon Book Club with Bookshelf staffers, Conquer a Classic episodes with Hunter, and more. Just go to patreon.com/fromthefrontporch.
We’re so grateful for you, and we look forward to meeting back here next week.
Our Executive Producers are...Jennifer Bannerton, Stephanie Dean, Linda Lee Drozt, Ashley Ferrell, Susan Hulings, Wendi Jenkins, Martha, Nicole Marsee, Gene Queens, Cammy Tidwell, and Amanda Whigham.
Transcript:
[squeaky porch swing] Welcome to From the Front Porch, a conversational podcast about books, small business, and life in the South. [music plays out]
“The mistake people make when life hits them with some unexpected, and often unprepared-for, catastrophe is that they think they can just return to life the way it was before. They try to rebuild exactly what they lost, but history proves how misguided that is. Disasters change everything, and we have to learn and grow from them, avoid the same kind of complacency that left us open to a blow to begin with.” - Amy Poeppel, The Sweet Spot
I’m Annie Jones, owner of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in beautiful downtown Thomasville, Georgia, and this week, it’s time for an episode of Literary Therapy. Before we get started, a thank you to everyone who’s been leaving reviews for From the Front Porch. iTunes reviews and ratings are how new listeners can best find out about From the Front Porch and — as a result — find out about our indie bookstore, too. Here’s one of my favorite recent reviews, from Jordyn-- not my Jordan, a different Jordyn:
My favorite book-related podcast I’ve been listening for over a year now and this is by far my favorite podcast for book recommendations. Annie and all of the other co-hosts read so widely that I end up finding recommendations for myself and the people around me. Whether you like romance, thriller, middle-grade, or general fiction, you’ll find some recs here (I would love to hear more about sci-fi and fantasy as well, but I’m still happy with the variance!). The episodes are the perfect length and the quality is great.
Thank you so much! If you haven’t left a review, all you have to do is open up the Podcast App on your phone, look for From the Front Porch, scroll down until you see ‘Write a Review’ and tell us what you think. Your reviews help us spread the word about not only our podcast, but about our small brick-and-mortar business, too.
Now, back to the show! If you’re new to From the Front Porch, every once in a while, I dive into the metaphorical mailbag and peruse your readerly hangups and bookish conundrums like a literary Frasier Crane, tackling your issues on air. If you have your own readerly riddle you’d like me to solve in a future episode, you can leave me a voicemail at the FTFP website: www.fromthefrontporchpodcast.com/contact. (There’s a link in the show notes, too.) You’ll scroll until you see the orange button on that page that says START RECORDING; click or tap there, and voila! I’d love to hear from you.
[00:02:50] Just make sure you leave your name and where you're from. It's been a minute since I've done one of these. I actually love this podcast format. I love recording these episodes, but we've had such a wide variety of other types of episodes this year that I haven't made the time to record one of these. So very happy to be sitting here offering some what I hope is readerly wisdom. Let's get started with this voicemail from Bailey.
Bailey [00:03:16] Hi, Annie, this is Bailey from Texas. I am a teacher. That's just ending summer break and going back to school, and I teach high school theater. So my literary therapy reading dilemma or request is I love reading about romcoms with teachers or books set in a theater. And I think on a past podcast episode you mentioned that theater seems to be having a moment in books, so I would love your recommendations. We are starting our fall musical, and I like to escape by reading about other people's theater troubles or antics or backstage showmances. I have Ghost Theater, The House is on Fire and Roomies. So those are a couple of books that seem to have a mix of the types that I like to read, but I would love your recommendations. Thanks. Love listening.
Annie Jones [00:04:12] Hi Bailey, you are speaking my language. First of all, I love Bailey. I follow her on Instagram and I just love other people's jobs. I just love learning about other people's work and especially people who love what they do and who do it so well. And this was a super fun request, partly because I like to consider myself theater adjacent. I was not a theater kid, but I love theater. I attended all of my college's shows. My high school did not have a huge drama program, but I did attend those shows in college. I wrote reviews for the school paper. I had several friends who were theater kids, and I believe I even painted a set a time or two. I really have a heart for theater. And I love being a person who can't do-- I can't do those things. Nor can I even teach those things, but I can enjoy those things. And so this was actually a really easy list to come up with. I hope that there will be something here that you haven't read yet.
[00:05:12] The first book-- and here's what I did. I have seven book recommendations, mostly backlist. I think it's all backlist. But I'm going to start in the order I think you should read them. Meaning it's late summer as I'm recording this. You are headed back to school, perhaps you are already there. So I think you should start with the books that have a summery setting and then work your way down. So my first book I'm recommending is called Summer Stage. This is by Meg Mitchell Moore. This is a Susie recommendation. So my mom came on the podcast, I think it was last year, might have been two years ago, and raved about this book. I think it was even one of the Shelf Subscriptions for Shop Mom. She had read Meg Mitchell Moore's previous work. And Summer Stage is about an adult sister-brother pair, and if I'm remembering this correctly, the sister runs a theater-- not a theater company, just an actual theater. She runs a theater in New England. And her brother (I hope I'm getting this right) is an actor and has made it big in Hollywood. And now he is coming home and is maybe going to help and put on a production at this theater. I believe that is my understanding. This is a very summery book. It obviously has summer in the title. It's got a great summery cover, very much beach book material. But what my mom liked about this one was that it's not a romance novel, it's not a romcom. This is about siblings. And I remember my mom saying it's really about the theater and really a love of this old theater that this family has owned and run for quite some time and how to keep it afloat. And I thought, Bailey, that it might appeal to you, though I think if you can, this should be a book read during the summer.
[00:06:57] Similarly, I am recommending Tom Lake by Ann Patchett; this book released to rave reviews late last summer. I think it was an August pub date and now is the perfect time to pick it up if you haven't done so already. You might have read this one already, Bailey, but if you haven't, this book is surprisingly a love letter, I think, to theater. That is not something I would have known. I'm not even sure I read the blurbs about this one. I just knew it was Ann Patchett's, so I just read it. But this is a beautiful ode to the theater, particularly to the production Our Town. If you are not familiar, it is about a mother who spends a pandemic summer with her adult daughters. They are picking cherries in their family-owned cherry orchard. It's all very idyllic and also complicated. But the mother is reminiscing and telling her daughters stories of the summer she spent at a theater helping this Michigan theater company and putting on a production of Our Town. I loved this book. As I'm talking to you, I'm like, should I reread this? I don't reread a ton of books, but man, I sure did love how that book made me feel. I said this on the podcast before, I am desperate to plan a trip to Michigan. I want to visit Michigan in the summer so badly. And I think I want to do that because my own southern summers are just not really the stuff literature is made of. But the more I read about New England, where I have been, and then Michigan, all these beautiful Emily Henry books set there-- anyway, I'm just dying to visit there because of books like Tom Lake by Ann Patchett, so that would be another recommendation.
[00:08:38] Several years ago, I read the book City of Girls by Elizabeth Gilbert. This book was the one that immediately came to mind. So when I sat down and made my-- I always listened to these voice memos and then type up some initial notes. And this was one of the first books that just popped into my brain. My book club read it, and I adored it. It was a little bit of a divisive book club pick, as I recall. So it is set in 1950s New York. It is an older woman named Vivian who is looking back. So the book is not written from a 1940s perspective. She's looking back on her adolescence and early adulthood in 1940s New York. She is a Vassar dropout. She winds up joining this theater company. She engages with this wide range and cast of characters. I loved this book. Like I said, it was a little bit divisive in my book club. I cannot remember why because I found it so charming. I love Elizabeth Gilbert. I don't know if that's a popular or unpopular opinion anymore, but I really love her writing. We've got another voice message later about nonfiction and fiction writers, and she is somebody who can go back and forth pretty seamlessly. But I really liked this book. I thought it was a love letter to theater, and I liked the historical fiction elements which I thought you might like to.
[00:09:53] Another book that immediately came to mind and is perhaps even more fun if you want just a fun, light kind of book, is When You Get the Chance. This is by Emma Lord. It's a young adult novel. Very fun, funky cover. This book has major Mamma Mia vibes. Millie is in high school. She's an aspiring Broadway star, and she struggles a little bit with highs and lows in her life and in a bouge of maybe trying to figure out who she is, she decides to embark on a search for her mother. And she has this great single dad, but she is desperate to figure out which one of her father's past lovers is her mother. Which is where the Mamma Mia of it all comes in. I was charmed by this book. Not every young adult book works for me these days. I feel like the older I get, I want to be able to reminisce and remember angsty teenage years, but I can't always get into that headspace. But this book I thought was lovely and again, was kind of an homage to New York, to Broadway, to shows and to theater kids everywhere. That is When You Get the Chance by Emma Lord.
[00:11:05] Then I'm recommending Limelight by Amy Poeppel. I love Amy Poeppel. We'll talk about her a little bit later. This book is about a woman named Allison. My memory of this is that she's trying to relaunch her career. There is a guy named Carter. Carter is a Justin Bieber type character who's like this pop star who's trying to make the transition into Broadway. And so he's the new star of a Broadway show, and Alison comes on board to help manage his career and manage this transition. I loved this book. Great New York setting, great Broadway vibes. I think you'll like it too.
[00:11:40] For more historical fiction, I always turn to Fiona Davis. Fiona Davis has a book called The Chelsea Girls, which is set in from the 1940s to the 1960s in New York, particularly at the Chelsea Hotel. Fiona Davis's books always revolve around a famous New York landmark, and then she builds a fictional story that's really rooted in historical accuracy. So this book is about a couple of young actresses trying to make it big in the city, and they decide to put on their own play with the help of some of their friends at the Chelsea Hotel. This book deals a lot with McCarthyism, which is something that has fascinated me. What does this say about me? This has fascinated me since encountering Death of a Salesman and The Crucible. I went through an Arthur Miller phase in high school. I don't know what that says about me. But I was a little bit obsessed with McCarthyism. Perhaps, maybe you were, too. I don't know. So the Chelsea Girls by Fiona Davis.
[00:12:35] And then last but not least, if you want a little dose of the 90s, Someday, Someday, Maybe. This is by Lauren Graham. Yes, that Lauren Graham. If you're a Gilmore Girls fan, maybe you've read her recent books. I thought her memoirs were lovely, but I actually really liked this book. It's about an aspiring actress living in Brooklyn in the 1990s. Obviously, it is very reminiscent of perhaps Lauren Graham's own story and her own expertise with trying to become the actress that she wanted to become. I loved this book when it came out. I was pleasantly surprised, because you never know, but I thought it was fantastic. And if you haven't read it yet, I think that would be such a fun book. So I would start with Summer Stage or Tom Lake, because both of those books feel very summery to me. City of Girls, When You Get the Chance, Limelight, The Chelsea Girls, Someday, Someday, Maybe all of those feel like they could be read interchangeably throughout the fall when you get the chance. Might be fun just because you are a teacher of young adult students. And so you might in particular really like that one. So Bailey, that was super fun. I hope one of those or more than one-- I hope lots of those work for you.
Natasha [00:13:46] Hey, Annie. It's Natasha from Columbus, Ohio, and I have a literary dilemma for you. As part of your Conquer a Classic challenge, I read Lonesome Dove and it was absolutely incredible. And I definitely think it will make one of my top books of all time. However, I struggle sometimes with classics and the harmful language that is often used, especially in Lonesome Dove. I still think it's an amazing book. It's unparalleled character development. But, of course, it was set in the 1800s in Texas, and there are a lot of racial slurs. And I just want to know how you balance being a 21st century reader and someone who is politically conscious with grappling with these really amazing books that may have some problematic language or themes. Thanks so much and love the podcast.
Annie Jones [00:14:48] Natasha, thank you for your thoughtful question. This is something that we talk about at The Bookshelf a lot. I think anybody who works in books, in media-- because this isn't just something that we come across in books, right? This is something we come across in consuming media of any kind, whether it's TV shows or movies. And so, this is a conversation we're having a lot at The Bookshelf, in person, in my in-person book clubs, in my in-person relationships, and on the podcast. And so, I'm grateful you asked this question, particularly as we are reading Lonesome Dove, which is set in the 1890s but was written in 1985 by Larry McMurtry. I honestly was pleasantly surprised by a lot of Lonesome Dove or I have been thus far. I'm not finished yet, so time will tell. But I had been pleasantly surprised. There is problematic language in this book. I do think it is language accurate to the time and to the characters we're getting that language from. And Hunter and I have talked a little bit about this in some of our Patreon episodes.
[00:15:53] But to address the question from maybe a larger perspective, if we're reading diversely in terms of release dates, so if we're reading classics, if we're reading books that were written 20, 30, 40, 100 years ago, we're probably encountering language that we don't use anymore. We're encountering themes that maybe have become outdated, problematic, maybe are not handled well. And so, what do we do with this? And I'll state first by saying my opinion is never going to be read less. Meaning my opinion is never going to say stop reading or stop reading those books. I'd also like to be very clear. There's a variety of opinions about this, certainly more than just my own. And if you listen to five different podcast episodes about this issue, I think you'll get five different responses. But I'm just letting you know that from my perspective and for my life as a reader, I'm never going to say read less, stop reading, don't read those books. That's not my personal approach.
[00:17:06] So my number one thought, my first thought, is read with an open mind. Instead of saying, well, I'm not going to read x, y, z, or I'm not going to read books that use this kind of language, or I'm not going to read books with this kind of theme. I'm not going to do that. Instead, what I hope I'm going to do is I'm going to read with an open mind. So if I'm reading Middlemarch or Anna Karenina or Lonesome Dove, or if I'm reading books from the '70s or the '80s or the 1950s, and the language is not what I'm accustomed to in 2024, I'm going to try to approach that with an open mind. I'm going to try to be cognizant and aware of when the book was written, of who wrote the book, of what perspective it's being written from. Particularly with fiction, I think this is important. Just because an author uses that language, perhaps that character is using that language, perhaps that character is problematic or is complicated or villainous. And so, who's using the language, who's speaking, who's writing? So when I read, I want to read with an open mind, paying attention to a book's context, when a book was published, when a book was written, who was writing it and why?
[00:18:27] I also think it's really important-- and I hope I do this well. I do not do it perfectly, but I hope this is something I try to incorporate in my own reading life, which is I supplement my reading. So if I'm reading books, like Lonesome Dove or other classics we've conquered together, or I'm reading-- I think about Hunter who has embarked on this journey through the National Book Award, and so he's reading all kinds of books that have been written across the decades. But he's also reading a lot of modern lit, and so am I. I hope. And so, am I supplementing my reading of older works with newer works that use modern language, that have diverse representation and diverse authorship? So if I'm reading a book like Lonesome Dove that's a Western told about these white Texas Rangers, is there a book that I could read that might focus on the stories of Indigenous or Native American peoples? Like, what book could I read? Could I read Louise Erdrich? Could I read C Pam Zhang? Like, who could I read that would also provide another perspective? And again, this goes to my overarching principle of don't read less, read more. And so if I'm reading Lonesome Dove, what am I reading to supplement that?
[00:19:47] So, read with an open mind, being well aware of the era in which a book was written, the purpose for which it was written, who was writing it, and then supplement that reading with works that perhaps are more modern in nature, that maybe tackle those issues or those themes from a totally different perspective. I'll use another kind of example. I know I mentioned Louise Erdrich. I know so many of us grew up reading and perhaps even watching Little House on the Prairie. That was a book series that I encountered early in my reading life. I have not revisited those books since then, but I recall loving them. I recall loving those stories. I recall watching that show, and I think that's okay. I totally think that's okay. I also am aware that Louise Erdrich has a children's series called The Birch Bark House, and so we have tried to carry those at The Bookshelf, too. So you not only have these books that I believe if I were to revisit them, I believe if I were to revisit Little House on the Prairie, I might be a little startled by some of what I encounter there. But I'm not going to stop reading them. And again, that might be different from your opinion.
[00:20:55] And I'd like to be clear, it's okay if you have a different opinion. It's okay if you're like, no, Annie, I threw those books away or I donated those books. I'm never reading little House on the Prairie again. Okay, that's totally fine. We're allowed to have different opinions on these things. My personal preference is to read more. So if I'm reading Little House on the Prairie, or if one day I get to have kids and I share with them Little House on the Prairie-- those books still hold a particularly special place in my heart, so I don't even know if that's something I would put in my kid’s hands. But I would also, in the back of my mind, know maybe it'd be cool to show my kids a different perspective and we could also read the Birch Bark House series. So this is what I'm talking about. If you're reading one kind of book or one side of a story, wouldn't it be beneficial to try reading another side of the story? So read with an open mind, supplement your reading. And then perhaps my favorite tip for this is read with a group. Discuss hard things. I am not an advocate of not discussing this stuff.
[00:22:00] Jordan and I were talking about this the other day. And Natasha, you're not the only one. Particularly as I was reading Lonesome Dove and I knew some of these questions were going to come up, and I told Jordan, I feel so ill-equipped to lead these conversations. And Jordan said, wouldn't you rather have them? Wouldn't you rather have complicated, messy conversations where you don't quite know where you're going to land and you don't quite know how you feel, or the best way to articulate something, or the most right way to do something. Wouldn't you rather muddle through it together? And the answer is, yes. I would much rather get on a podcast with Hunter. I mean, look, in an ideal world, would I be having these conversations where thousands of people are listening? No. I'd much rather be having these conversations in my book club, in person with Hunter, in person with Jordan. That's where I love having these conversations. But it's a privilege to get to have them on a larger scale, too. It's a privilege to have these conversations on Patreon. It's a privilege to try my best to address these topics here. And again, I don't do it perfectly.
[00:23:09] I am well aware of how messy these conversations and how fraught these conversations can be. But when I come back to it, I think about Jordan saying, but wouldn't you rather have them? And so when you're reading books where like, oh, that makes me feel a little icky, or I don't know how that topic makes me feel, talk about it with a friend. Buddy read something together. Read it in a group, listen along with a podcast. I do encourage in-person conversations as much as possible. I think we allow each other a little more grace that way, but I think podcasts are good for this, too. And so, hopefully, Hunter and I are helping us navigate these waters as best we can. But reading them in a classroom, reading them with a small group, reading them in a book club context, I think all of that is so beneficial because then you're reading and discussing and thinking, and it's helping you figure out what you think and how you feel, and it's helping you have to articulate things. So again, read with an open mind, supplement your reading and read with the group. And my overarching thought, which is read more, not less.
[00:24:27] I don't know if that's perfect advice, but I'd also encourage you to not aim for perfect, to just aim for you're reading your best, you're doing your best. You're trying to navigate these conversations and these issues with grace. You're trying to make room for a variety of worldviews from a variety of perspectives, so show yourself a little bit of grace, too. Because I would hate for somebody to stop reading. I'd hate for somebody to be, like, I don't know what to do, so I'm just going to stop reading anything. And I don't think that's what you're going to do to Natasha, but I would also hate for people to stop reading the classics. I still think there's something worth reading there. And read the classics, but read more. Read more perspectives. Read more authors. Read beyond the names we've always read, but don't stop reading. That'd be my overarching suggestion.
Angela [00:25:23] Hi, Annie. This is Angela. Just wanted to say that I love y'all's podcast, and you've given me so many good book recommendations in the past that I was hoping you guys could help me with one more. I was really looking to read more books with chronic illness or disability representation. I know Fourth Wing was huge for that, so I've read that. I also read the nonfiction book by Meghan O'Rourke about her journey with chronic illnesses. I was just wondering if you guys had any additional things to recommend, fiction, nonfiction, anything? Thanks so much.
Annie Jones [00:25:58] Hi, Angela. Okay, I immediately had a recommendation, and then I thought, well, I think that's a holiday recommendation, and it is August, but I'm going to mention it anyway. The first book that immediately came to mind because I thought she handled chronic illness representation so well is The Matzah Ball. This is a book by Jean Meltzer. I encountered it when it released a few years ago. It is a great holiday romcom featuring a Jewish protagonist who has chronic fatigue syndrome. What I love about this is that Jean Meltzer has chronic fatigue syndrome, and it had a huge impact on her career and it is what turned her toward writing books. And I think there's an author's note in The Matzah Ball that kind of addresses that. She has since written several other books. I think she's on book number four. They're not a series. They're standalone. Her new book actually releases, I want to say, next week. It's called Magical Meet Cute. So all of these are romantic comedies, but if I'm not mistaken they all have an element of chronic illness. Whether the main protagonist is experiencing chronic illness or something like that. And it's partly because of the author's own experience, which I think is really valuable and helpful. I love The Matzah Ball. I have not read Jean Meltzer's other books, but I believe she would be a great place to start.
[00:27:18] Next, if you haven't already, I would suggest Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow. This is the book by Gabrielle Zevin. It kind of took the world by storm a couple years ago, and I loved that book. But something people didn't talk a ton about-- or maybe they did, and I was just not in those conversations or aware of those conversations-- is that the main character, Sam, one of the main protagonists, experiences chronic pain. And part of the reason the book deals so much with video games and is a lot about video games and video game culture. Part of the reason Sam finds himself drawn to video games is because he is in so much pain in his body. There's actually this great quote from the book that I'll read to you. He said, "Sometimes I would be in so much pain. The only thing that kept me from wanting to die was the fact that I could leave my body and be in a body that worked perfectly for a while." And I thought that was such a lovely, honest, gut-wrenching reminder of what people dealing with chronic illness and chronic pain deal with and what their lives look like. So Tomorrow and Tomorrow and Tomorrow by Gabrielle Zevin has a lot of the themes I think you're looking for, a lot of the representation I think you might be looking for.
[00:28:33] Then I thought of the young adult book Everything, Everything. I read this years ago by Nicola Yoon. She actually has a new book out this year that's, I think, her first adult novel. Olivia talked about it on a recent episode. But this is her one of her young adult books. The main character has severe combined immunodeficiency, and so she rarely gets to leave the house. And this is kind of a young adult romance about what happens when she falls in love for the first time. Now, it's been a long time, but I recall loving this book and loving the ways Nicola Yoon dealt with this character's illness and how she navigated that.
[00:29:13] This book I have not read, but I do think Hunter read it and loved it. That is All's Well by Mona Awad. Bailey, if you're still listening to this episode, this is also a theater adjacent book. So this is about a woman who is a theater professor. She has an accident that leaves her in chronic pain, and she is struggling to navigate and direct a Shakespeare production that she's putting on. This book released to rave reviews years ago. And I don't know why I didn't read it, because when I was reading the description I remember Hunter liking it and literally every bit of the description, I thought, well, I would like that. So maybe, Angela, you would read it. You could read it and report back because it looks really good. It's got a really great cover that you might recognize, too. If you're a frequent book buyer, I think it's a fairly recognizable cover.
[00:30:06] Another book that came up in my research, and I think we carried it at The Bookshelf, but I have not read, is Lycanthropy and Other Chronic Illnesses. This is by Kristen O'Neal. It's about a young woman who has to drop out of college because of undiagnosed Lyme disease. Lyme disease is something I think about a lot. I don't know if it's just because of where I grew up, and there was an FSU football player, years and years ago who had a very public bout with Lyme disease. And anyway, I just think about Lyme disease a lot. And so this is really interesting where the main character has to drop out of college. Lyme disease is often misdiagnosed. And so, she kind of goes undiagnosed for a period of time. And then she encounters help and support through an online support group. And so she and one of the women from the support group meetup. So that might work for you as well. That is by Kristen O'Neal.
[00:31:01] Another romcom, this came up in my research. We've sold several copies at the store, but I have not read this one. Get a Life Chloe Brown. This is by Talia Hibbert. This book gets rave reviews, I think four stars on Goodreads. Romcom with a chronically ill main character. It then sent me on a deep dive to a book I started years ago. I did not finish this one, but you might be interested. Black Girls Must Die Exhausted by Jayne Allen. As I recall, the main character in that book is dealing with a recent diagnosis. And I believe it has to do with infertility, but perhaps also some mental illness. And so, that book may deal with some of the same types of things you're looking for or some of the representation you're looking for.
[00:31:44] I also just finished-- it's not even out yet, but I just finished a book called Blue Sisters by Coco Mellors. This is not necessarily like an uplifting kind of book, but it does talk really honestly and openly. For me, this is one of the first books I've read that deals so openly with endometriosis. It's not the world's most cheery book, but if you like literary fiction and complicated characters, you might want to try Blue Sisters by Coco Mellors.
[00:32:17] Hello Stranger by Katherine Center is a way more fun kind of book, and it's dealing with a young woman with facial blindness. And Katherine Center, I think, always does a really good job of including author's notes in her books and all of the research that goes into the characters and the plights that they face and the struggles that they have. And the way she talked about facial blindness, I think, could be really comforting or encouraging to someone also grappling with chronic illness. So those are some recommendations for you, Angela. I hope something there might work for you.
Deja [00:32:49] Annie, back for round two. Deja from Texas. I am rereading Wild Game by Adrienne Brodeur. And then I know she came out with Little Monsters last year I think, or the year prior. Do you have any more recommendations of an author who has written a memoir and has written a fiction novel? I'm just really digging that book coupling, book dueling. Anyway, thanks.
Annie Jones [00:33:27] Deja, hello again. Deja is a frequent voicemail leaver. Literary therapy consultee. I don't know. Client? Sure. And she's a supporter on Patreon. Deja, this was a very fun question because I immediately-- I mean, there's just a slew of authors that I could think of, but then I had some that I felt like were even more in line with Adrienne Brodeur. So first of all, just off the top of my head, I thought, Ann Patchett, Elizabeth Gilbert, Anne Lamott, Madeleine L'Engle, Jesmyn Ward. Those authors all have gone back and forth between fiction, nonfiction, a little bit of memoir. And so, all of those authors immediately came to mind. But then I thought, well, specifically like Adrienne Brodeur. If we're really moving beyond just memoir and fiction, but also the themes they're writing about and stuff like that, who would qualify? So I immediately thought, CJ Hauser. CJ Hauser, you know I love. She Wrote The Crane Wife, which is a memoir in essays, just absolutely one of the best books of the last 10 years. I think it's excellent. She also wrote a couple of great fiction books, but very different fiction books. I think the one that you would most like if you haven't read it already is Family of Origin. So if I'm only picking two books-- I'm trying to model the Adrienne Brodeur Wild game and then Little Monsters. If I'm just recommending two, CH Hauser's, The Crane Wife and Family of Origin.
[00:35:03] Also, Patricia Lockwood. Patricia Lockwood wrote the memoir Priestdaddy, which I think Hunter and I devoted an entire podcast episode to years ago. We loved that memoir. I mean, there is some stuff in that memoir, but we loved it. And then she followed it up with fiction called No One Is Talking about This, which I did not read, but Hunter read and loved, and I think somebody else on staff-- I can't remember if it was Lucy. Somebody else on staff read it and loved it. It was very much of its time. I think it was kind of pandemic related. And so was a book that maybe not everybody wanted to read in 2021. Or maybe it was dealing with social media. I can't remember, but I felt like it was a very prescient novel. So that's Priestdaddy and No One Is Talking about This.
[00:35:50] I also thought of Carlene Bauer. You might know her like I do from Girls They Write Songs About. Or Frances and Bernard, a beautiful book I love. But she also got started with a memoir called Not That Kind of Girl, which is still on my shelf and I am still going to read that darn thing. It just continues to kind of be on my TBR list, but I'm really interested in it because she talks about her evangelical upbringing and then her coming of age in New York City. So certainly something I think I would really enjoy. So her memoir, Not That Kind of Girl and then her fiction Girls They Write Songs About/Frances and Bernard.
[00:36:28] I also thought about Ann Hood. This would be kind of a Susie pick. So she wrote Fly Girl, the memoir about her experience as-- back then they would have been called stewardesses, but a flight attendant. My mom loved this book, even though my mom does not fly. And then Ann Hood, she has a ton of fiction, but her most recent one came out this spring. And actually several people have DM'd me and said, me and my mom would both love this book. It's called The Stolen Child. It's got a beautiful cover. So Deja, I think sometimes you and my mom have overlapping tastes, so this might be somebody you could start with.
[00:37:02] And then one of my favorite authors of all time, but I do not talk about her very much on here, and I think it's because in my Bookshelf life I haven't read as much of her. But boy, did I love Anna Quindlen. I first encountered her regular column that she had in Newsweek magazine, and she has a memoir called Lots of Candles, Plenty of Cake. I liked that, okay? I loved her columns, and I love her fiction. Her most recent book is After Annie, which I have not finished, but I started on the audiobook and I did really like it, but I love a lot of her fiction. So she is somebody who a little bit like Ann Patchett or Elizabeth Gilbert, goes back and forth pretty regularly between fiction and nonfiction. So, Deja, I hope that gives you plenty to work with. I thought that was a super fun question and a great thing to start paying attention to. As somebody who's working on a book herself, I get a lot of hope from people who write both. I have never been particularly good, I don't think, at fiction. But a girl can dream, and it's nice to see authors who are able to do both really, really well.
Caroline [00:38:06] Hi, Annie. This is Caroline from Walnut Creek, California. My current bookish conundrum is that I want to read Conquers, really long books, including Lonesome Dove. But about 100 pages in and my progress has really stalled. I find that I will commit to a buddy reading schedule, and then once I get behind, I have a really hard time catching back up. I'm curious if you have any tips on how to tackle a long book, especially as we head into the dog days of summer? Thanks.
Annie Jones [00:38:41] Okay, Caroline, this is an interesting dilemma because I think my advice for you would be different than my advice for me. So I think you and I might be different kinds of readers in that it sounds to me like slow reading might not work for you. Meaning it might not work to tackle a tome across 12 months’ time or six months’ time. Several people this year in reading Lonesome Dove have informed me that they just went ahead and finished. And I think that's totally fine. Nobody's getting gold stars for finishing early, and nobody's getting gold stars for taking all 10 months. Like there's no gold stars here. I mean, I know that kind of sucks. There's no gold stars in adulthood, but there aren't.
[00:39:25] And it sounds to me like reading a book, a long book across a long period of time might not be the method that works best for you. So I was thinking, have you ever tried reading a book over the course of, for example, a summer? Or reading a book in one month? So years ago, I think a good friend of mine, Julianna, she's been on the podcast before, I think she and a friend buddy read Lonesome Dove, but they did it over two months. They just read it over the summer. And my mom notoriously finished Lonesome Dove ages ago. I think she finished it back in January or February. And so, I'm wondering if you prefer, as a reader, binging or reading quickly, or getting lost in a good book and reading lots of pages or lots of chapters in one sitting? Because it sounds like where you get overwhelmed is when you get behind. A lot of this depends on how your brain works and what other things you're reading while you're reading something long. Like, meaning I'm reading a bunch of books at once. My mom doesn't really like to do that. She wanted to finish Lonesome Dove because her brain works best focusing on one thing at a time. I don't love this because I don't really actually think it's that great for me, but I am able to juggle a couple of stories at once.
[00:40:48] So I just want to encourage you to be thinking if slow reading actually works for you, and if it doesn't work for you, could you try reading a long book in a shorter period of time, reading it in a month, reading it over the course of a summer, taking spring break? Okay, and this is the other thing, we're not getting gold stars for how many pages we read. So only read a long book if you want to. But let's say you're reading even something like-- it's not 800 pages, but Same As It Ever Was by Claire Lombardo. That's a pretty long book. Maybe you say to yourself, I'm going to read that book over my kids fall break. Or I'm going to read that over Labor Day weekend, and I'm going to hunker down and I'm going to take it to the pool every chance I get, whatever the case may be for you. I'm just wondering if a long weekend or a week or a month might be better for you than trying to spread a book out over the course of months? Because if I'm hearing correctly, your overwhelm is happening when you get behind. So maybe the key is to not get behind, to read something, to dedicate yourself to a book over a certain period of time or while you're in a certain place like if you're going to a cabin for a week or you're going to the beach for a week or whatever.
[00:41:55] The other suggestion I have, is have you tried alternating between different formats or among different formats? So this is not something that I have tried with Lonesome Dove, but I've definitely used it for other books, even All the Colors of the Dark, which is quite large. I read some of that in electronic format, and then I read most of it in physical e-book format, but I went back and forth for a bit. In the past, I think particularly with Bleak House, I listened to it on audiobook sometimes and then I picked it up and read the physical format. So changing up format might help you read more quickly and therefore not get behind. Changing it up so that, oh, I'm going to read this in the car while I wait to pick my kids up from school, or I'm going to read this on a road trip. I'm not going to listen to podcasts over this period of time. I'm only going to listen to the book, something like that. And then maybe this is just stereotypical millennial of me, but I think treating yourself and rewarding yourself upon completion of something is very important.
[00:43:02] So when is the last time you treated yourself for reading a long book? In school we had book it, we had Pizza Hut stars, we had gold stars on a chart, we had somebody telling us, good job. There's really nobody telling us good job anymore, which, honestly, is probably more healthy for us. But it's also kind of a bummer to not get recognition for this thing that we've done. It's part of the reason we do merch at the end of every Conquer a Classic season because I firmly believe people deserve a reward for making it through an 800-to-1000-page book. So treat yourself with a dinner out, or with a reading lunch where you're going to read part of the book while you're out at lunch. I love my friend Abby Bay. She's got a store By Bay Jewelry online. Maybe you treat yourself to a little piece of jewelry that matches the vibe of the book you just finished or something like that. Or you buy a t shirt after you finish Lonesome Dove. I gave my mom a leather carrot bookmark after she finished Lonesome Dove. Something to kind of signify, look what I did! And that way, the next time you attempt a long book, you know you're going to get a reward at the end of it. Maybe that's silly.
[00:44:16] Like I said, maybe that stereotypical millennial. But I do like little treats for finishing a project or a task that long has been weighing on me. And sometimes reading a big book certainly counts as that. So pay attention to if slow reading works for you. Schedules might not work for you. I mean, you shouldn't feel bad for getting behind. People have lives, you can't read all the time. And so maybe investigative slow reading doesn't work for you. And if it doesn't, can you read a long book but over a shorter period of time; alternate between different formats and then reward yourself upon completion? Those are some of my tips to help you try to stay on track as you tackle these longer books.
Georgia [00:45:03] Hi, Annie. This is Georgia from Ocean Springs, Mississippi. So I'm calling because I often find it difficult to find books that are light and page turnery, but really well-written and not always romcoms. So three books that I've loved are The Inn at Lake Devine by Elinor Lipman which sort of is a romcom, but it's just so smart and funny and snappy. And then last year I loved Pineapple Street by Jenny Jackson like everybody else did, and also really loved My Murder by Katie Williams. It had a little bit of speculative fiction. There was a lot about women's lives and a little bit about serial killers and motherhood and all kinds of good stuff. So, yeah, books that are light, page turnery, witty, not that vapid. Thanks so much.
Annie Jones [00:45:55] Georgia, I hope somewhere in your Instagram bio it says not vapid. Because that description of books made me laugh out loud because isn't that the truth? Isn't that all we want in this life, is light hearted books that aren't vapid? It seems such a low bar, but it's so true, I think those books are hard to find. And I think you have hit the nail on the head. We get requests like this a lot at the bookstore. Just because somebody likes light hearted or feel-good fiction doesn't mean they just want to read a romcom. And I love a good romcom. That's no shade to the romance genre. It's just that's not all we want to read all the time. So this question really resonated with me. And not vapid is just-- the way you said it at the very end, I love it. Thank you Georgia. I do have what I hope will be some good recommendations for you. Some of these authors may already be familiar to you, and so I've tried to provide a range so that hopefully you can discover something new. But as for me and my house, the go-to author, I think the queen of this is Katherine Haney. She wrote a short story collection called Single, Carefree and Mellow years and years ago that I read and adored. But she has since written several fiction books that I really enjoyed, including Early Morning Riser, which is her latest. She wrote Games and Rituals, which was another short story collection which was also great. But Early Morning Riser, gosh, I just absolutely loved that book. I really loved it and I loved the people in it.
[00:47:30] I frequently will mention Katherine Heiny in the same vein as Amy Poeppel. Amy Poeppel wrote Musical Chairs, which is a book I read during the pandemic and loved. But she also wrote a book called The Sweet Spot. I started with a quote from that book at the top of the episode. Limelight, which I mentioned to Bailey with her theater books. I think she's just a go to great author who's writing lots of whip smart, feel good fiction that doesn't necessarily have a romantic element really at all. Just really great, thoughtful and I think still well-written fiction. I also think the author Cat Shook falls in this category. She has a new book out called Humor Me, but I also love her first book that came out last year called If We're Being Honest. I think part of the reason I like Cat Shook is because she's a New Yorker. She lives in New York now, but she grew up in Georgia and I think you can tell that her books have a real southern sensibility to them. And I think her characters are really memorable and interesting and overall really likable but still complicated. And that makes her books really easy to read.
[00:48:38] I don't want to overwhelm you, but I'm going to keep going. J. Ryan Stradal and his all of his books about the Midwest. I love Kitchens of the Great Midwest. I think it was his debut. It was my first time I had read him. But he's also written The Lager Queen of Minnesota, Saturday Night at the Lakeside Supper Club. I think I got that right. I adore his work. Recently, I read Jeff Zentner's Colton Gentry's Third Act, and I totally got J. Ryan Stradal vibes from that book in the best possible way. So I think Jeff Zentner is another person who would fall in this category. He's also coming to The Bookshelf for our From the Front Porch live show, which I'm very excited about. But I think his books fall into this category. Emma Straub, The Vacationers in particular, reminds me of this type of category or this type of book. Margo's Got Money Troubles, if you haven't read that. I think I talked about that in a recent reading recap episode. And let me tell you, I love that book. I really love that book. And part of the reason I love it is because I am rooting for all of those characters as they make terrible mistake after terrible mistake. They are doing things that I would never do. They are making decisions that make me cringe and cry and be nervous for them. But man, do I love them.
[00:49:55] And so when I think about light hearted books with rich characters, good writing-- and let me tell you something, Rufi Thorpe is a good writer. The things that she is doing with perspective in that book, chef's kiss. I have not read Knockout Queen, which was her other book, but certainly interested now. RF Kuang I think falls into this category with something like Yellowface. Rainbow Rowell in particular, her most recent work, Slow Dance, which does have a romantic element but I think is doing a whole lot more. And then Weike Wang, I think, she has a new book coming out in December. But all of her books that I've read certainly feel like they're written by a really strong, good writer, but they're also dealing with characters that I really like and I'm rooting for. Goodbye Vitamin is another book that I think would be great. And then The Misfortune of Marion Palm, which is a backlist title from several years ago. I'm trying to think. Maybe last but not least, Rabbit Cake by Annie Hartnett. Okay, I'm going to stop now. That's a lot of recommendations, Georgia. I hope I didn't overwhelm you.
Julie [00:51:03] Hi, Annie. This is Julie calling from Washington state. And my literary therapy question is now that you have a book that is in the works of being published, what is your next dream for yourself, either with The Bookshelf or the podcast or some other facet of your career? And how can we support you in it? All the best. Happy summer!
Annie Jones [00:51:25] Julie, this is such a fun question to end on. I feel like now I will be therapizing myself. Now that I have done therapy for everyone else, I will turn my attention to me. No, I really do love and appreciate this question. As you may or may not know, I have been-- I think Julie knows, but I don't know if you the listener know. I've been writing a book and it is going to be published by-- y'all know this. You know this. I interviewed Jonathan Merritt my agent on the podcast earlier this spring. So anyway, yes, I've been writing a book and I've written it. At this point, it's done. It's done. I'm working on copy edits right now. It has been such a wonderful, interesting, intellectually stimulating experience. I think I had really high expectations of what I thought writing a book could be like. I have always wanted to write a book. This is not a new thing. As much as I love The Bookshelf, it's not something that The Bookshelf instilled in me. This is something I've wanted to do since I was a little girl. And the fact that it is something that totally met my expectations, is wild.
[00:52:40] As you know from listening to podcasts. I grew up religious. And still I'm religious. Still I'm a practicing Christian. And one of the verses that I love the most in Scripture, is it has this phrase, "Live a quiet life and work with your hands." And that has long been my goal. That has been what I want, is to live a quiet life and work with my hands. And sometimes I worry, am I doing that? Is this podcast living a quiet life and working with my hands? And I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. But I do think writing a book has been really creatively fulfilling. I adore The Bookshelf. I'm not going anywhere. I love The Bookshelf. But being able to write this book because-- make no mistake, because of The Bookshelf.
[00:53:32] Being able to write this book because of The Bookshelf, because of the podcast has been such a gift. And I think the act of writing it felt like living into that mission of living a quiet life and working with my hands. I would like to write more books is the short answer to your question. I also have bookstore related dreams. I still want to do reader retreats on the road. If you're a reader retreat, I've probably talked to you about this or hinted to you about this. I actually have an idea for how to make this happen. And so reader retreats on the road, meaning where I would come to you, I would hit the road or I'd come talk to your book club. I'd host a reader retreat in other towns. And I've been thinking how would that tie into the mission of The Bookshelf? How would that benefit The Bookshelf? And I we've brainstormed that as a team. And so that is something bookstore related. And then I hope I get the chance to write more books. I think I have more books in me. There are no guarantees, but I think I do. And now I realize why authors just promote the heck out of their books, and it's because they need to sell their books so that they can write more books. Because when it comes down to it, publishing is a business and so much is going to depend on people buying my book next April.
[00:54:51] The book releases next April. I do not have a preorder link for you, but one day soon I will. And when I do, that is something you can do. That is something you, the listener, can do. Is preorder my book, request it from your local library, talk to your local bookseller, help get the word out about that book, because sales of that book will help determine if I get to write another one. And I would love the opportunity to get to write another one. And so, I don't know, Julie, if that's totally the answer to your question, but those are the things that I have been thinking about. I've been thinking about reader retreats on the road for The Bookshelf quite some time. For quite some time I really wanted a bookmobile a few years ago, and I just am not sure that that's practical. But boy, I know what I could do. If I had it, I think I know what I would do with it. But I think reader retreats on the road is actually something that could benefit The Bookshelf and also speak to something I really love, which is travel and talking to other readers. So that's something.
[00:55:47] And then I really hope I get to write more books, because writing books is living quietly. I loved sitting at my desk with the windows open and Sam at my feet writing this book, I really did. I did not know if I would, and I really, really did. It's some of the best, most fun work I've ever gotten to do, so I'd love the chance to get to do it again. So I'll let you know Julie when you can preorder my book. I'll let all of you know when you can preorder my book. Because more than ever I understood as a bookseller, but now as an author I really understand why authors can be downright obnoxious promoting their book. It's because they want to keep doing it. They want to keep writing. And now I get that more than ever. So thank you everybody for your thoughtful, thoughtful questions. I hope these answers were helpful to you. I hope you got good book recommendations. I hope you received the incentive and encouragement that you needed to keep reading. I love these episodes. Thanks for sharing so much of yourself with me. I really appreciate it. This week, I’m reading Intermezzo by Sally Rooney.
[00:55:49] Annie Jones: From the Front Porch is a weekly podcast production of The Bookshelf, an independent bookstore in Thomasville, Georgia. You can follow The Bookshelf’s daily happenings on Instagram at @bookshelftville, and all the books from today’s episode can be purchased online through our store website:
A full transcript of today’s episode can be found at:
Special thanks to Studio D Podcast Production for production of From the Front Porch and for our theme music, which sets the perfect warm and friendly tone for our Thursday conversations.
Our Executive Producers of today’s episode are…
Cammy Tidwell, Linda Lee Drozt, Martha, Stephanie Dean, Ashley Ferrell, Jennifer Bannerton, Gene Queens
Executive Producers (Read Their Own Names): Nicole Marsee, Wendi Jenkins, Susan Hulings
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